UPSB v3
Advanced Tricks / Wrist movements as tricks
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Date: Fri, Mar 5 2010 03:50:58
Hey all,
So I've been thinking, we've primarily categorized wrist movements as stylization, but how about naming specific movements and creating a new basis for tricks or sub-tricks which affect the trick going on, another 'layer" for instance, many of you may know gyration of the wrist during a charge can produce many different "types" of charge normal based on wrist direction, movement and palm direction....
I think developing tricks or just naming and categorizing things like this can help bring penspinning out of the "flat" screen 2d that we see, encourage creativity as not just creativity but the norm, encourage live performance with a more 3-d aspect of penspinning make it more exciting add difficulty etc. thoughts?. -
Date: Fri, Mar 5 2010 05:25:46
sounds like a REALLY good idea
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Date: Fri, Mar 5 2010 20:53:53
there'd be too many tricks =\ and it'd be hard to categorize what wrist motion is new and what's old/variation
and it's also hard to tell when the wrist motion is going on, like during which tricks are being simultaneously done
i suppose it's possible if we name a few and keep things simple...but then people will begin to move their hand in all kinds of ways and call them all new tricks
when someone is trying to copy a combo, they need to know a bit more 3 dimension to the combo that they're gonna do... so they have the trick breakdown, and then the video to give them everything else
a few of the commonly seen things though, yea, they probably need a name, to help with breakdowns, but i don't think it should be a 3rd dimension kinda thing, just incorporate it into the breakdown as another regular trick -
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 00:58:06
so JC, are you saying we should have separate certain COMMON wrist motions that go along with a lot of tricks?
I was also thinking of like wrist motions over a hybrid or minicombo that change the rotation of it relative the hand, etc.
Also, this could be another addition, like reverse inverse etc. , again I think wrist movements are a bit more complex than that so I think wrist movements that change the pens rotation relative to the normal and starting point of the tricks rotation should be renamed, if wrist movement is involved....
Then wrist movements that do not alter the trick in any way stay the same, things like moving stalls is a good example of that.
ON THE OTHER HAND(haha pun)
Wrist movements like I said before, could be thought of as a sub category of tricks which are added, this would encompass things like moving stalls and let spinners describe for instance a counter clockwise sweep Csweep or a clockwise sweep CCsweep 9from pen spinners angle), or a straight<-- just throwing out examples of names that could be used.Of course once defined I really don't thing there are that many new "tricks" so to speak, things like Csweep from a s position during a charge for instance would go against intertia and thus be a 'wrist utilizing" trick under the first paragraphs of this posts def, again this is very ahrd to visualize but the pen actually spins differently when you do a charge and a Csweep ( hand pivoting clockwise around the wrists joint from starting position of S. so this "trick" would be a CSCharge normal -
Date: Sat, Mar 6 2010 10:06:28
if wrist movements become part of breakdowns, i think it'll only be part of the formal notation system, just like the 2h1p notation palm side notaion and the push/catch notation
if i shoutbox'd a pyralux breakdown, no one's gonna reply with full palm side, push/catch, wrist movement notation
what they'll write is tw sonic 23 12-> pass rev 12 23
but, as a part of the formal notation system, i believe is a plausible idea -
Date: Mon, Mar 8 2010 03:40:38
seems unnecessary. wrist movements should not be used to the point where they need their own naming system.
even though ppl like pyralux use them like buttloads, they are all very simple wrist movements.
and no. wrist movements will never change the relative movement of the pen in relation to the hand. if the relative movement is changed, you are simply doing a different trick/hybrid.
the other issue of wrist movement naming is that you would need two "tracks" of notation. in track one you would have the trick breakdowns, and in track 2, you would have wrist motion. it could all be combined into one "track" but it would be complicated as fuc...
THIS IS WAYYYYYY TOO COMPLICATED AND CUMBERSOME. IT IS TOTALLLYYYY UNNECESSARY. NO ONE WOULD BOTHER USING WRIST MOVEMENT NOTATION CASUALLY, ANYWAYS. (as kryder said) -
Date: Mon, Mar 8 2010 04:23:39
I'm not sure what you mean, it isnt a different trick... its the same trick only because your wrist is moving the path it rotates in is different....
and the double track was only an example... I think currently there are few enough tricks requiring wrist movements and yes its better to keep them simple but we could get into very complicated wuns as well, that if we jsut create a few new names for tricks itd be fine for now...
you're you're simply doing a different trick/hybrid is why i made this topic, because it IS a different trick/hybrid isn't it? so it should have a different name... -
Date: Tue, Mar 9 2010 21:48:15
well a lot of wrist turn things can be broken down as charge harmonic :/ i dun think wrist movement notation is necessary
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Date: Tue, Mar 9 2010 22:35:39
Right but who is really going to right the tricks down using charge harmonics and palm turns, using naming a few common changes would be helpful, much like fist spin or spider spin are specific names and thus most of us can visualize the trick, if those tricks wee written out long not as many people would "know" them?